First of all, I’d like to apologize to anyone whom I ever mentioned Packet 8 to in the past. Here’s why…
After being an ATT CallVantage subscriber for over 2 years and finding the service to be reliable, high quality and feature-rich I decided to switch to Packet 8 because the service appeared to be similarly featured and $10 per month less expensive. I had also told several people that I thought it was a good deal and that they should try it, so I was taking my own advice.
In all fairness to me, I also based this decision on the fact that call quality via services such as Skype, Yahoo IM and other VoIP offerings have improved so dramatically in the past few years. The logic was that any large VoIP carrier would probably offer similar call quality, so Packet 8 seemed like a relatively good deal ($20 per month vs. $30 with ATT).
I couldn’t have been more wrong…
After ordering and installing the Packet 8 service, everything worked. I wouldn’t say that it worked well, just that it worked. Over the next 60 days or so of using the service we came to learn much more about the difference between Packet 8 and ATT. Here are the things they DON’T tell you about their service before you sign up:
- It takes a long time to get a dial tone. You have to wait 5-10 seconds before you can even dial the phone. This meant that on our phone system, when we dial the number and then hit the talk button no call would ever go through. This is because the phone basically adds a pause for a reasonable time to wait for a dial tone and then dials the number. With Packet 8 you have to hit the talk button, wait an eternity and then dial. May sound like a small annoyance, but after you’ve done this 100 times it get’s really old, and this doesn’t occur on CallVantage.
- You must dial 1 before every number. That’s right, even local numbers within your area code. What’s up with that? With ATT and every cellular phone I’ve ever used you only need to dial the area code and number. Why can’t they get their system to do the same?
- Although calls were always completed (assuming you didn’t jump the gun and dial before the dial tone came on) at least 50% of the time we experienced intermittant issues where either we, or the people on the other end of the line, were not able to hear or distinguish what the other was saying. This type of thing is very hard to pin down and it took a while before we suspected that Packet 8 was the underlying cause; however, with ATT we had never had this issue, and since switching back the call quality issues have disappeared. Nothing else has been changed in the equation.
- Faxing will absolutely not work through a Packet 8 phone line. There are all sorts of threads on their community forum with tricks people claim to have employed, but it just doesn’t work. Works perfectly on the ATT line though…
- You can’t check your voice mails on-line with Packet 8. This is such a standard, basic feature of VoIP that I never considered it. But basically you have to call in to get voice mail.
- Their web site simply sucks. The usability and navigability of it is awful. You can tell that they only intend for people to use it to set up the service, but they don’t intend you to go to it on any sort of a regular basis. And why would you, I guess, when you can’t check voice mail there, and it’s nearly impossible to find features such as “find me/follow me”.
- Their Web site also doesn’t allow you to modify or remove your stored credit card information. So, I guess they intend to hold on to your credit card data no matter how you feel about that.
So, after these and other annoyances I decided that Packet8 was not for us. I went online looking for some way to put in a service disconnect, but to no avail. Remember, the web site sucks.
I then found a way to open a ticket and asked them to cancel the service, after which I immediately received the following letter:
Dear Customer,
In regards to your email, we are sorry you’re considering canceling your packet8 service.
If it is your desire to cancel, please contact a customer service representative the day you would like your packet8 service to terminate.
A 5.99 monthly fee gets you all the packet8 to packet8 phone calls for free but for those regular calls it will cost you 3.9 cents per minute. This is an attractive option for those who wish to finish out there 12 month agreement instead of receiving a $59 Deactivation fee.
Please note that if you choose to terminate your Packet8 service within twelve (12) months of the purchase of the service, a Disconnection Fee of fifty-nine dollars ($59.00) per account would be charged to your credit card as indicated in the Terms and Conditions.
To Contact Support
1-888-898-8733Packet8
Monday – Saturday 5:00 AM to 9:00 PM P.D.TThank you,
Packet8
Gee, you think they get a lot of cancellation requests? They are obviously well prepared, and they instantly want to point out to you that they are going to charge you $59 the second you try to cancel. Also, they make you call in to the 800 number to actually cancel.
So, I called in and told them I wanted to cancel because the call quality was very poor. I also explained that I didn’t think they should charge me a cancellation fee because I had an expectation of reasonable call quality when I signed up and they did not deliver.
The rep proceeded to tell me that since I didn’t call in and open trouble tickets and try to work with their tech support to solve the problems that they wouldn’t waive the fee. Had I done so, they would – but they had no reason to believe that I actually had problems. I asked for a supervisor, but that person took an even harder line.
They said that if I had wanted to cancel without penalty I should have done it in the first 30 days. It didn’t matter to them that I had paid for the hardware, the initial setup fee, and the monthly fees up to this point. They still wanted their $59 cancellation fee.
So, bottom line is, I would no longer recommend Packet8 to anyone, for any reason and I now appreciate ATT CallVantage far more. I’m not claiming that ATT is perfect, for example their tech support hold times are too long, but it’s still far superior and well worth the extra money.
Footnote:
For the techies out there I should state that the Packet 8 Terminal Adapter was connected directly to the cable modem in front of the router. The call quality issues were NOT because it didn’t have unfiltered access to the net.
Additionally, we pay for the highest level of cable modem service offered by our ISP. We get 12 mb down and 768kb up. We use a Uniden phone system with 10 handsets and it is in perfect working order.
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I see that you made this post in Oct. of 06. In fairness to all parties you should know that all of the issues you had with the service have been upgraded (local number dialing, online voice mail, everything). With the exception of the website still sucking, and also their fax line service i believe they offer as another line for a very low cost. As per your call quality issues, i am guessing that your isp is ATT or is running on the ATT backbone. They are famous for being against net-neutrality. They probably use QoS to drop their competitors packets on purpose as they have been caught doing in the past. So despite your direct connection, and your large amount of bandwidth it was probaly your isp and not packet 8 as I have been a customer for years and always gotten call quality superior to traditional phone service, and further more i always get instant dial tone. Last but not least, you made a legal contract, you understood the risks involved, its all in nice Arial font. Alltel for exsample charges a $200 early termination fee for their cell service. Guess $59 ain’t so bad when you think about it. However if what you said is true, their customer service is crap (the supervisor being rude). That is a shame, but again I’ve never known anyone but you to report that.
NEMO: You don’t have any idea what you are talking about. You sound like you work for the stupid company. This SMART man has it exactly right. This is not the first I have found that Packet 8 SUCKS! AND I am another who has been deceived by this company and I think that a Class Action Lawsuit needs to be started against this fraudulent company. Unlike the other guy, I never used the service, because when I signed up they told me it was fax capable. THEY DO NOT HAVE FAXING CAPABILITIES, one of the many lies that I was told. The customer service does suck. I’ve been hung up on several times, transfered countless times, and with no avail have been able to get these people off my back. I am still fighting with my credit card company to remove the fraudulent charges. Anyone else with me?
Can’t even get signed up on-line. When contacting live help, the response is a lagging ticker saying something like. ‘Looking for an available Tech’….. until finally another, ‘Cannot find one’. Granted it is midnight. Though, this is a sign, believe me, especially for those who are trying to get a message out at that time and cannot get dial tone, or anything resembling a phone to work.
Back to the tin can string routine!
End of trying to sign on with P8.
On to Vonage…. seems logical, hmmmm.
Kema
Well, in Holland we are having HUGE problems with VOIP. Mostly it’s capacity problems that will deactivate the telephone lines and DSL connections. On my personal blog i am viewing this trent in Holland (Dutch) and i think it’s still not ready to deploy at 50% of the customers. Better wait…
Well, Vonage is also NOT good! see http://askmrcreditcard.com/creditcardblog/review-of-vonage-voip-phone-service/
Frank
I build VOIP networks for a living. I’ve used PacketHate for years, and despite occasional outages, mostly liked it UNTIL my DTA (terminal adaptor that you plug you analog phone in to) bit the dust. The support case stayed open for 3 weeks. You can only swap an ethernet cable and do a hard reset so many times. when they finally agreed with my original statement – that I thought the 3-year old DTA had gone bad, they informed me it was out of warranty and I would have to pay for another. I told them to get bent.
I was a Packet8 subscriber too. I switched to a virtual pbx system provided by Easy Office Phone http://www.easyofficephone.com instead. I have had no quality issues at all. I like that they charge us not based on the number of employees (extensions) we have but rather its based on the number of telephone lines we use on average in a given month. We currently have 8 employees and we are only paying $99 a month for this service because on average we only usually have two people on the phone at once. I think this is a better business model because its less expensive than paying per extension (more like a traditional pbx system) yet we have no limits of the number of incoming/outgoing simultaneous calls. The customer service has been really good, we were assigned an account manager who we can call anytime if we had a question or need help.
Thank you SO MUCH for your blog and comments. I was a SunRocket customer and they did all right, but just went belly up. They have now selected Packet8 as one of the companies SunRocket folks can sign up with instead! Zoiks! THanks for warning me away!
I was a former Sunrocket subscriber who signed on with Packet8.
I chose the annual plan ($199) for former Sunrocket subscribers.
I prepaid the plan + equipment shipping costs.
Low and behold a small $3.69 charge appeared on my credit card this month (about 6 days after my 30 day trial). In addition to the $3.69 charge, I was also whacked with a $5 detailed billing charge.
I about busted a jugalar vein. Whats the point of prepaying for a year if they are going to whack me for another $9 per month?
Of course when I called, the customer service rep told me I could not cancel my account. Well. actually I could. I would be charged a $59 termination fee, but would not get a refund on my $199. I about went ballistic.
My advice is to stay away from Packet8. Or go the monthly route. If u go the annual route, you will have no way out plus be charged additional fee’s on a monthly basis.
Alan,
I’m sorry to hear about your issues. But if it has been less than 60 days and you charged it on your credit card initially you should be able to lodge a dispute with the credit card company and get the fees reversed on grounds of false advertisement. Just make sure that the agreement you signed up didn’t explicitly state that there would be additional monthly fees charged.
John
“Give me a couple of minutes while I pulled out your account”!!!! What a system they have internally for customer support! Can you believe it takes 120 seconds to pull out a single record?
I have the same situation: former SunRocket customer, same deal of surprising charges in my credit card and same situation with cancelling the account. Now I also want to add that it took 29 minutes to get a CSR to answer the call.
On the other hand, if you don’t follow up on you LNP forget about Packet 8 will do that!!!!
I am a Vonage customer and, I have to say DUH!!! to myself, I don’t know what in the world I was thinking when I chose Packet 8. Please stay away from this company.
Alan, brother I totally agree with you. It was EXACTLY 32 DAYS past activation. They do this intentionally so that they profit if you cancel. In fact, over the past 2 days I have filed complaints with the FCC, FTC and the attorney generals (Ohio) regarding the way Packet8 handles it’s Annual Plan and price disclosure.
The best way to fight these companies is to file complaints with the FTC, FCC, and Attorney General. Filling complaints with BBB is a waste of time for these types of businesses since who calls BBB for VoIP.
I was a former Sunrocket customer and went to Packet 8 because I thought they had a rate. Sunrocket had an Annual Plan that charged $199.00 + USF. Packet 8 does the same thing except they charge you for taxes and additional NON required fees they charge their customers for their cost which they bill monthly -something that should be illegal. What is the point of having an Annual Plan if you have to pay monthly? My blood pressure soared to its highest levels when I spoke with Packet8. You get none of your money back for the annual plan and you pay $59.00 to disconnect. Rep told me it’s legal because it’s in the T&C (Terms and Conditions). I was like who the heck reads that for the prices. Packet8 T&C is so one sided that it surprises me that it’s eveen legal
My advice is file complaints and tell people not to go to Packet 8. I think this company should be sued for misleading customers. It is NOT AN ANNUAL PLAN IF YOU HAVE TO PAY MONTHLY IN ADDITION TO THE ANNUAL PLAN. To make it even worse, Packet 8 can charge at ANYTIME they want higher rates so again what does the Annual Plan buy you???? Nothing…NOTHING BUT TROUBLE!!!
I hope someone files a class action lawsuit to Packet 8 for misleading customers.
I know exactly what all of you are saying. That’s why I have filed a complaint with the FCC and providing this link for you to follow suit. I’m not sure if this will make things change but we can all make sure we are being heard. My situation is similar to buckeye’s post. I am pissed…
File complaint with the FCC here: http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cib/fcc475.cfm
With regard to Packet 8 I have a whole lot to say. First off, the company is a rip off to say the least, they are mismagaged, the training is horrible and their policy is “sorry, we cannot help you with that”. I know because I worked for packet 8 and it was a struggle to lie daily to the customers about the issues that were clearly packet 8′s fault (although the customer would be charged for problems out of their control). Also, I would like to mention that packet 8′s employers insist that you go to work sick (only to infect other employees) and then get FIRED for taking sick leave. Personally, due to the information that I have personally on Packet 8, I would NEVER recommend this service to anyone. If you have any questions about packet 8 I would be more than happy to divulge any information that I legally can to help you with your issues. My suggestion would be to get out now-but cancellation charges (no matter what your circumstances are) will be applied. I suggest you retain an attorney first before your call to packet 8. Good luck to you all
I got schlepped over to packet8 when sunrocket went down, and while sunrocket had it’s issues (the worst actually being that they sold user email addresses to spammers!), packet8 has been much more of a headache. Lots of technical issues that they blame on ISP, but clearly not related to ISP. I get beeping noises (not caller ID) on the phone that other party can hear, calls fail to make phone ring and go straight to v-mail. Vmail just doesn’t activate for some callers. Often have to dial a number twice before I connect.
I’m switching to att and crossing my fingers. I’m also going to try to avoid the disconnect fee since i have been complaining about these problems for quite some time, but it sounds like I probably won’t have much luck with that. Bastards.
ATT has promised me there is no disconnect fee with them as long as I send in my adapter – hope I’m headed for something better before I just through in the towel on this whole voip experiment.
I definately agree, Nemo does sound like a representative of the company. Also the service of the phone and the company is horrible! I called to cancel my home phone service with them beacause it sounds the same as their cell takes forever and very poor call quality and was old only then about any cancellation fees. I wish it was $59, to cancel a home phone they charge $99.99. Whatever you do, don’t contact them for business! It is definately not worth the money you save!
i work for a competing telecom/VOIP provider, so it’s not to my benefit to defend a competitor ;) however, i will say that i’m not aware of any similar company who will give people credit when they never once called technical support. to my knowledge, every telecom and ISP wants people to call and report problems so that they can attempt to correct them. we don’t automatically know there are problems if they aren’t reported.
everything else you mentioned sounds awful though. one way to avoid quality issues with VOIP is to choose a company who installs a separate connection vs. piggybacking on your existing connection. if you use a service that piggybacks on your existing internet connection, every time your internet connection has troubles your calls will too. if you use a service that installs a separate connection for voice, your normal ISP won’t have any impact on the reliability of your calls.
Was a customer for many months (well over a year, I believe). At first, service was great. Then we started having a very frustrating problem. Phone would always work for outgoing calls, but incoming calls would not connect quite frequently. I work all over the country, so I’d be trying to call home and about once a week or so, I’d get one of the following:
-Rings endlessly on my end, doesn’t ring at home
-Rings a couple times on my end, then a fast busy signal
-Goes straight to voicemail (somebody ELSE’S voicemail, no idea who)
-Message “subscriber you are trying to reach has travelled out of the service area”. (???)
Most common symptom was phone would ring endlessly on my end, and not make a sound at home.
Many calls to packet 8 to report our phone was out got stuck in an endless loop:
Me: “My phone is out again”.
Packet 8: “You need to be home to troubleshoot this.”
Me: “If I was home, I wouldn’t even know that the phone was down.”
Packet 8: “Is anybody home who can help us troubleshoot this?”
Me: “Yeah, my wife is home. (sarcasm mode on) Feel free to call her. OH, wait…” (sarcasm mode off)
My wife never kept her cell phone on when she was home, so I couldn’t just call her to tell her to call Packet 8. But if she did have her cell phone on, it wouldn’t have helped. How do I know this?
After several months of this crap, I get a call at home from MY WIFE on MY CELL PHONE telling me that our phone line is down again. So I call Packet 8 on my cell phone to report that NOW I’m HOME, and the phone line is down again. Their tech support confirmed that we had a faulty adapter.
Packet 8 refused to send out a replacement adapter when I requested one.
We are no longer Packet 8 customers. Apparently, if the equipment breaks, the only option is to switch providers.
Before someone suggests it, our Internet connection is fine. And it works great with our new VOIP service, voipyourlife.
PACKET8 SUCKS BIG TIME, i.e SUCKS BIG BIG TIME. and their customer service is horrible. I was a former sunrocket customer, signed on to packet8 because of all those bogus marketing saying good rates, no hidden fees etc. For the last 7 months I missed so many incoming calls. Outgoing call quality is not great either, but you get connected and other side people can here your machinely voice. I just got out of packet8 cusomer services supervisor. He just repeats the same thing like a well trained pet. I was told that because I never called to complain he cannot do anything. But what do you do if nobody picks up for half an hour to 45 minutes. I doubt there ability to maintain customer service logs also. After couple of unsuccessful tries, I spoke to customer service to get the voice message access number. Customer rep says that entry is not in the logs either. So what is the guarantee that they log my complaints. I was told that there is no cancellation fee. YES THAT IS TRUE, THERE IS NO CANCELLATION FEE EVEN IF YOU CANCEL WITHIN THE CONTRACT PERIOD. But there wont be any refund. Yes, there should be a class action suit on this fradulent company.
Sounds like a lot of unhappy customers at Packet8.
I am originally from Denmark, so I am using a local Danish provider to have my Danish phone / number here in the Philippines, I have never had any problems with this company (Musimi) and I am very happy about the service/product.
Kim:)
I use a Packet 8 VOIP device in India. I have been a customer for 2.5 years. I must say that I, too, am very unhappy with quality of Packet 8′s service. In short, every now and then, my device asks me for an activation code, the old activation code no longer works and the technical support staff are very reluctant to provide customers with new activation codes (which sometimes is the only way I can get the device to work again). Calling support from India (when you don’t have the device working) is also very inconvenient :-)
nothing has changed. and, clearly you work for the company. it is a script and it was read to me today my shannon in cancellations. the only difference in my situation is that (1) i never was able to get the bloody thing activated AND I WAS STILL CHARGED(2) I sent two or three emails requesting HELP and received bogus and lame responses to them. Not even a link directing me to the site (3) the Web site STILL SUCKS. Explain to me why, why, why would information about activation be buried in the non-subscriber section of the Web site (4) why would the activation section contain two different directions for activation (5 ) why would there be a link for PPoE that doesn’t work (6) as a matter of common sense, building a consumer brand, good judgment would you penalize a customer (prospective, current or past) for a service they could never use. Is this really smart business? BTW, I was charged $59.99 for something I never used.
i also filed a complaint with the BBB. as of today…3/10/08 there were 339 complaints processed.
An update to my previous post. I called Packet 8 customer service 3 times. First time, the rep was courteous but unhelpful. Second time, the rep was neither helpful nor polite. I got lucky the third time – rep was friendly and helpful, managed to help me fix my problem and suggested that I not disconnect my device for long periods of time (she did not know why, but she had found that people have trouble when they reconnect their device after keeping it unplugged for a long period of time).
I am still thinking of switching to Vonage, but the little lesson I learned is that if you are not making progress with a particular customer service rep, it sometimes helps to try again later and hope for a better rep.
i learned that Packet8 has close to 400 complaints processed by the BBB in Silicon Valley alone. So, I lost my number, cancelled my account, got charged $59.99 AND just received an email that I have to send the “free” phone back at my own expense.
True, I’m a customer and the fax is unreliable. Ironically, the number I have the most problem with is their own.
My last support ticket was answered. After 9 weeks, a new record (old record was Time Warner at 2 weeks). Why even bother to reply to a 2 month old email?
I am in Packet8 hell, I can’t get my toll free # off my ATT bill because Packet8 is too incompetent to process the request. Ironically they continually insist I fax in a new request form.
I’d love to. But my fax doesn’t work.
Also, all numbers dialed require a 1 + area code, local or not, and you cannot get a fax number w/ an area code of your choosing….
Not that it matters, since our fax service has never really worked.
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