Posted on Feb 07, 2007 - 1:31am by John P. in Computing, Reviews, Tools
This site has been getting a lot of visitors from the search engines due to my previous posts about the PlasmaCAM CNC Plasma Cutting Machine.
These visits have translated into quiet a few questions coming in via my contact form. Several people considering the purchase of a PlasmaCAM have received the DVD from them and have been asking me how much of it is true. After all, Stan makes it sound so easy to start creating anything you can imagine from metal with this machine. ;-)
As a result, I’m going to walk you through the video step-by-step and provide analysis to help separate fiction from fact.
If you’d like to print this out to keep handy while you are watching the video use the Print this Post feature (also at the bottom of the article) to format it a little better for that purpose.
For convenience I’ve embedded an excerpt of the video from the DVD.
If you would like the full DVD please contact PlasmaCAM and I’m sure they’ll be happy to ship you one out.
Let’s Get Started!
Below you’ll find the time marker in minutes and seconds, followed by my opinion on the issue presented at that time.
0:00 – 1:00: The DVD starts off with some shots of a wide range of parts and completed projects all cut by the PlasmaCAM.
Yes, it did cut all that stuff, though the pieces you are seeing have also been welded, finished and powder coated.
1:15: We first hear Stan Ferris’ voice asking:
“Wouldn’t it be nice if you could make these kinds of products with only a small amount of effort?”
Well, yes Stan, that would be nice! But frankly you can’t. Most of the projects shown required a considerable amount of artistic creation, which translates into hours and hours of digitizing followed by a considerable amount of cutting, welding, grinding and powder coating.
Metal fabrication is a dirty, sweaty, hot, dangerous, capital intensive business and should only be attempted by people who have adequate training.
Personally I’m a trained welder, blacksmith, bladesmith and power hammer operator. I had over a years worth of experience operating a plasma torch before I ever purchased a PlasmaCAM, and without it I’d have had major problems getting this machine to operate at times. I’ve also taken college level AutoCAD courses and am an expert with CorelDraw for graphic illustration.
1:51: Stan introduces himself as a:
“…nuts and bolts kind of guy…” who “…under normal circumstances I would not have tried to operate a computer controlled machine….”
Well, here are a couple of comments to get us started:
There is a small amount of video instruction, but PlasmaCAM desperately needs to create video tutorials on how to use the features of this product. There is simply nowhere near the amount of training material available that I think there should be.
You are not going to want to use the PlasmaCAM software to create designs unless you absolutely have to. Think of it just as a clean-up and cutting package.
2:57:
“The robotic cutting table plugs into your computer just like a printer.”
Not true anymore.
100% of the printers sold today plug into your computer using either a USB, Ethernet, or Wireless connection. The PlasmaCAM plugs in using the old style parallel port connection, and when I was setting my machine up this was the greatest source of issues. I had to call and get support from George (who is awesome!) to get mine working.
This is a bigger problem than you might think… Since the machine requires a parallel port you have to use a computer that has a parallel port built in. This will exclude many of the PCs available today and all of the laptops.
You cannot use a USB to Parallel port converter as it won’t work. If you purchase a PC without a parallel port then you’ll have to order an add in card, and these are almost impossible to find now days as well.
Make sure you have this covered before you purchase a PlasmaCAM!
Commentary:
PlasmaCAM is well behind the curve in the connectivity arena. Not only should the machine offer USB connectivity, it should really have a wireless NIC installed that allows us to control the machine over 802.11x.
Either of these would bring the machine into the modern age, but wireless would be vastly preferable.
3:00:
“The machine uses your ordinary plasma torch to do the cutting. It’s easy to remove in case you need to cut by hand.”
Well, kind of. If by “easy” you mean “possible”. But it involves disconnecting cables, cutting plastic tie downs, plugging in adapters, remounting and calibrating things… You’re not going to really want to remove the torch unless you absolutely have to.
3:32: What Stan is demonstrating is not something you’re ever going to see happen in the real world. He’s taken a perfectly printed photo of a single leaf, on a completely white background and scanned it. He is then converting all of the colors except the white background to black, essentially creating a single filled in shape.
Let’s look at a more realistic example. Here is a little key shaped bottle opener that I designed by sketching it on drawing paper with a pencil.
This whole process can be completed in 1/10th the time using CorelDraw. So if you don’t know how to use it go find a graphic art course at your local community college and learn Adobe Illustrator or CorelDraw.
3:55: Scaling, rotation, cut path creation, copying and moving the image are actually as easy as they say. That is not to say they couldn’t use some improvement…
Commentary
One of my biggest disappointments is that there hasn’t been a single software update since I purchased the machine, despite the fact that there are a number of areas that could be improved.
This fact, combined with the lack of USB or wireless connectivity support leads me to believe that software development at PlasmaCAM has ceased.
And this is one of my greatest sources of concern for the longevity of this product. All of PlasmaCAM’s competitors release frequent updates and improvements to their installed user base.
5:10: Frankly I do not believe that they were able to cut that entire sheet of leaves out automatically and unattended.
5:17: Interestingly, I can’t find Cash Metals on the Internet anywhere. I must have Googled for 15 minutes with no luck. I even paused the video on the pages of their catalog and searched for product names, but nothing turns up.
Despite that, I believe that everything John Cash stated was accurate.
6:35: It’s really a shame that they don’t have a video library that shows how to use all the features they are demonstrating here. It would have made learning how to use the software so much easier…
9:05: Ok, this is important to note. Between the times the machine cut the sign out and Stan picked it up, it was obviously moved from a production area machine to the machine in the video.
The plasma cutting process spits out dust and smoke in copious quantities! The floor beneath the machine would be burned and filthy, and there is no ventilation system present. Finally, without gloves, Stan would not be able to pick up that metal seconds after the machine finished cutting.
Commentary
You need to be aware that any plasma cutting process, including the PlasmaCAM, puts out a ton of airborne particulate matter that requires adequate ventilation.
When I went to the PlasmaCAM headquarters outside of Denver and got a demonstration of the machine they had it in a really cool little room that had ducting which vented the machine to the outside of the building.
If you are going to get a plasma cutting machine you need to plan to put it in an area where you can blow all of the smoke and dust either outside or through an expensive air filtration system.
9:10: Here’s a link to find more info about Dan Romano. He’s a metal artist and the things he makes are close to what I do. I agree with everything he said.
11:22: This is the best example in the video of what I was talking about when I said that small or unusually shaped parts would not quite fall through the grates. Notice that the piece which was just finished tilts up and is sticking up above the surface of the original material.
If the machine attempts to move over that area, which it might well do on its way to cutting something else, it will collide and screw everything up royally.
A collision of this sort will bend the piece that is sticking up, knock the torch head out of alignment, move the base material -making it difficult to line back up and restart cutting, and potentially even ruin the torch tip ($15 wasted instantly). I’ve also had the entire torch head assembly pop off the unit during one collision with thick material.
Bottom line, this is not good… the only way I can think of to solve this issue is to have a tighter mesh of grates to hold the material, but neither PlasmaCAM nor anyone else I’m aware of have yet solved this problem.
11:39: I’ve not yet tested the indexing of parts longer than 4 feet yet, mainly because I’m scared of ruining a large, expensive piece of steel. Whenever I do test it, I’ll post about it, but if anyone else has tried please provide some comments below.
Remember, you can cut things longer than 4′ but not wider than 4′! So, a 3.5′x7′ sign would work, but a 4′2″x 5′ would not. The table is a square 4′x4′.
13:21: Stan claims,
“This part is being drawn to exact dimensions in only 14 seconds.”
There is something strange with the video here, because Stan claims it’s just 14 seconds, but when I play it back it’s more like 11 seconds. This makes it seem as if the video has been time compressed.
Additionally, they would have to be typing in lengths – while creating the part – in order to make it “exact”, so I just don’t see anyone being able to go that fast.
11:15: Some people have asked about the thickness capability of the PlasmaCAM. Here we see it cutting 3/8″ thick material. Later you’ll see 1″. The thickness of cut is going to be determined by your selection of plasma torch, not the PlasmaCAM.
I use a Hypertherm 1000 which will cut at least 1″ thick material. But keep in mind that the thicker the material, the more it weighs. And you have to be able to load the sheet on the machine…
14:02: Jim LaTour from Turbo Engineering Corp provides good examples of what the machine can do. For his type of business the machine is perfect.
Conclusion
There is far more content on the DVD that I’m not going to go through. But if you are interested in seeing it, by all means contact PlasmaCAM and order the DVD. They’ll be happy to send it to you.
Now, I know this review comes across as being fairly harsh on the PlasmaCAM video, but please keep a few things in mind:
Frankly, there is a short list that will let you know if a PlasmaCAM is right for you:
I hope that this information was useful. If so, please drop me a comment below to let me know. :-)
By the way, I LOVE comments! Please feel free to leave one below!
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Thanks very much for taking the time to evaluate the plasma cam and its software. I have limited experience in everything you have mentioned. You might have burst my bubble over the plasma cam. I was so looking forward to purchasing a unit. If these people are that dishonest on demonstrating their unit on the dvd ( I have it ) and that far behind on their software and computor up dates then I don’t think I want one.
Terry,
Thanks for the comment, and I’m glad if the article helps out.
I would like to clarify a couple of things. First, my dealings with everyone at PlasmaCAM have been first rate. I don’t consider anything they say in the DVD to be “dishonest”. I just consider it to be marketing spin.
For someone like me, with experience welding, plasma cutting, and designing in the PC the machine really is easy to use. But, without all of that experience it would be very difficult. And I’ve heard multiple stories from people like yourself who thought it might be easy to pick up on but who later found out they weren’t equipped with the necessary skills.
In fact, one gentleman posted on my PlasmaCAM Part 2 page about this very issue. And of course, this is why I took the time to go through the video step by step. I hate to think that anyone would dish out this kind of cash without being able to use it.
Take care,
John
Any other complete systems you might recommend looking into. I’ve priced the component parts to a system like the PlasmaCam and I think they are asking a bit to much money for what they offer.
Duke,
If you simply price out the parts for what it would take to build the system it might seem a bit inflated. In fact, I’ve seen kits that will allow you to build a machine for less and save a few thousand.
But there are some things that you have to consider about going that route as well:
– I believe PlasmaCAM is now offering 3 years of technical support with purchase. It is impossible to overstate the value of this feature. I’ve yet to find a problem that George and the gang haven’t heard before and aren’t able to solve with a simple call.
– PlasmaCAM has to deal with replacement parts under warranty. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard of them sending someone a replacement motor or other part. These things add up.
– The PCAM controller and software were developed in house. Those can’t be purchased on the open market, so it’s hard to assign a value to them.
Having said all of that, a few other systems I looked into before buying my PCAM included:
– Torchmate – offers some of the least expensive systems out there. Even kits.
– Practical CNC – offers some nice looking small tables that will also do routing.
– DynaTorch – also offers unfinished kits.
– DynaCNC – the table I would have liked to have purchased, if it wasn’t so heavy and if they could have shipped it within even a couple of months.
Ultimately, you can see the route I chose to go mainly for the size/weight of the machine, the well established user community, and the tech support.
Hope that helps,
John
Hi
I have plans for buying this machine when I build my shop later this year.I’m a retired welder with over 40 years experience and 15 years with computor graphics.I have enjoyed very much reading about what you have said about the machine.It seems that one of the hardest things to find, is ideas on what to make.
Thank you so much
Al Zampieri Lewes,Delaware
you’re right, there’s no way you can program to cut an entire 4×4 piece of small pieces and walk away. after two or three, one will tilt at an angle and catch with the torch head. i am having problems with too much slag residue on the bottom side. i cut 12 gauge and use a miller spectrum 625. any input on settings, speed, etc. i would appreciate. thanks
Mike,
Sorry, but I don’t have any experience with the Miller Spectrums.
Generally speaking, if you are getting a lot of dross you are cutting too slow, have the torch head too high, or worn out consumables.
With my Hypertherm I looked in the manual and it tells the exact speeds to use with each tip type and material thickness, so I would recommend checking your Miller manual to see if there is something comprable.
Also, that doesn’t solve your problem, give PlasmaCAM a call and talk to George. I’d be willing to be he’s got the settings for your machine memorized. :-)
Take care,
John
I just bought a used plasma cam. the guy who had it owned it for 3 months and had a welding and fab shop, but never learned to use it. His biggest mistake was trying to use thermaldynamics and essaub plasma cutters. He thought the main box was fryed. we bought is, hooked up a hypertherm 1000 to it and my 1st time 19yr old son had it up and going in 2 hrs, and by the 3 hr was already designing parts and cutting them out. If you good on a pc and do like directions say, use hypertherm plasma cutter. The nice thing about people who don’t follow plasma cams suggestions on prefered plasma cutters to use, is we saved 4,000.00 on buying it.
Wow! That is a great buy!
One more thing, the machine does work well. And we did add a extra ground wire to help on contact on metal that was not so shinny.Also while searching for a used plasma cam i met a few people and ask questions. One guy was selling his plasma cam, so i ask why, he said he bought a bigger 40,000.00 table because work was great, i ask him how he liked the plasma cam software and he said he wished he could use it on the new larger machine, it was easier. The part my son made was a 10″ x12″ plate with 8 bolt holes around the out side flange, with a 3 1/5 inch center hole. I was taking us 45 mins to 1 hour to make these with a hand torch and drill press, now the part is saved and we just print as many as we need.
im glad to hear it wasnt just us that are having so many problems and dissipointments, with plasma cam we have everything put together and ready to cut, isnt happening, we also have found alot of discrepecies , not just anyone can put it together and start cutting , we are , searching for someone in our area to give us some help, cutting by hand seems alot easier at this moment.
thanks for your information, FRF
i love my machine!! it does have a few bugs to work out when you first get it, and of
course it takes some computer knowledge and training,,,, but i dont have a real problem with programing my own drawings into finished product. after years of doing this by hand, plasmacam aint bad at all… i never touched a computer till 2000, and had my 10n year old son teaching me the basics, but i dont see that operating the plasmacam is any harder than doing basic work in like microsoft publisher or comparable program. its just a matter of picking out the commands you really need to do the job at hand, and jsut as important, what to ignore…. ive been making a living as an artist in salt lake city and park city, utah, for about 8 years now with my plasmacam, and would be lost without it…
just one artist opinion…email lazyjz@excite.com, for product ideas, any help with running the machine, or anything else.
thanks, troy
We have found out there are many a few steps that must be done in order to go from design to cutting. sample if you have abcdefg, you can’t do acfg. you have to do all the steps. The first 15 minites my son did get frustrated some, but then he found out it was not the plasma cam, or the soft ware, it was somthing he over looked or settings were wrong, or he forgot to initalize.
Yes, that is true. You must go through a Pre-cut checklist.
And that’s not even a complete list! But of course, it’s well worth it because you end up with things that you just couldn’t have made without it.
Take care,
John
I saw the problem with the airborne particles on my daughters machine. I fabricated some side “skirts” to help control the airflow under the machine and cut down on the openings for the particles to get out. Also fabricating a “drip pan” with a bit of water to place under the cutting bed which will help greatly in the particle clean-up.
Hey John,
Mmmmm where to start. . . .I am right on the brink of purchasing a plasma cam. Your blog has created some doubt in my mind as to whether I should purchase the plasma cam to manufacture the tool I have invented. I have invented a tool for the fire service, yes I have a patent pending, (boy what a process that was!!!). I will be cutting the tool out of 1/4 inch stainless steel. After checking out all my options (lazer, water jet etc. . ) I decided to plasma cut it myself. The costs to outsource would have put the cost of the tool to high for the market. It sounds like I can deal with all the issues that you mention in your blog. Would you be so kind as to share with me anything that would help me in the production of this tool. We (my father and I) will be setting up a shop at his place and producing the tool on our own. As I said before we will be cutting the tool out of 1/4 inch stainless steel, then tumbling them to round the edges. Is there anything for your experience that I need to know about cutting stainless that would help this process to go smoothly. I don’t have a picture of the tool on my website yet, but if you would like to contact me you can go to the website and my email contact is at the bottom of the page. The website is http://www.tugtool.com any help you would be able to provide to this rookie would be much appreciated!!!!
Thanks Brian
Brian,
Here are many random stream of consciousness thoughts in response to your comments:
You made the right decision regarding plasma cutting because 1/4″ stainless can not be cut economically with Waterjet or Laser. Plasma will however make short work out of it assuming you get a big enough plasma torch.
Stainless is a little harder to cut than plain mild steel, so the torch I’d recommend is actually the exact one I own, the Hypertherm 1000. You could also step up to the 1250, but the consumables will cost a little more and I don’t think you’re going to be able to manufacture the parts much quicker.
I’m not sure what the dimensions of this tool are. Knowing that would help me tailor my comments a little better, but I’m assuming that it may be about 12″ long and probably narrow. If that is the case, depending on the shape of the tool you may be able to tell the machine to cut out a whole sheet and leave it unattended to do so. However, if it’s long and narrow with a strange shape on the end you might have to monitor the machine fairly closely and cut only a few at a time.
I can’t tell for sure, but from your background in firefighting I’m guessing that you don’t have a lot of welding / plasma cutting experience. This could be a major problem with the plan to manufacture these tools by yourself. I could not recommend the purchase of this expensive machine to someone without plasma cutting experience. There are a lot of things that can go wrong:
If you received the video from PCam and were “sold” on the idea but you don’t have any experience with these machines then I really would recommend reconsidering. I do NOT want to deflate your hopes and I’m not telling you that it’s impossible, but I am telling you that there are hundreds of details that take time to learn and any one of them could keep that machine from operating properly.
On the positive side, if this one tool is the only thing you need to make then it should be much easier to operate since it’s going to be very repetitive. But it would probably be very helpful for you to spend time with an experienced operator first before you actually purchase a machine to make sure you think it’s something you can do.
I’d be happy to cut you out a prototype on my machine if you like, or if you come through Dallas I’d be willing to show you how it works.
Another option for you would be to find someone with a machine that is willing to cut these parts out for you at a reasonable rate. They’ve already spent all the money on the shop, so you can avoid that. I would say that you are going to have to sell a LOT of these tools to make enough to cover the cost of buying and operating the machine, but someone who already has one that is doing other things with it can probably make them cheaper for you than you can.
Other than that I’m not sure how to provide additional guidance, so let me know if you come up with specific questions.
John
Hey John. . . it Brian from California. . . on 04.26.07 I had posed questions to you in regards to purchasing a plasmacam. It seems like ages ago!! You had a lot of good advice when you posted back!! Just wanted to update you on how things have progressed!!
We did purchase the plasmacam and all the equipment needed to manufacture the “Tug Tool”!! We are doing it all ourselves at my parents place in WA state. I just wanted to let you know. . . YOU WERE RIGHT!!! Boy what an adventure this has been . . . . I think we hit all the pitfalls you mention in your post!!! Through it all we are now pretty darn efficient at cutting out the tools, (I have also expanded to cutting out parts for 2 other tools for the fire service!! I can even muddle my way through Autocad and transfer the drawing into plasmacam with ease!!! I have sold about 30 Tug Tools and we are now just gearing up to get the business running full speed!!! So I just wanted to take this opportunity to thank you again for all your input!!!! I hope you don’t mind if I ignored some very good advice on your part . . . and stubbornly plowed through!!! He he It has been a great learning experience so far and I look forward to the next stage of making this business a success!!! (Of course I had to decide to try and make a business successful in this economy!! Oh well)
Again thank you for all you advice!!!! If you would like to see the website I put together go to http://www.tugtool.com
Thanks again and take care!!!
Brian
does anybody know who is the direct competitor of plasmacam or who has similar products with plasmacam?
Ed,
I posted about the competitors here.
John
Hey John,
Thanks for the response. . .I have been out of town for a bit and just got the chance to get back on here.
My Pop who lives up in Washington has found a guy locally who has used the plasma cam for many years. . .. This gentleman has offered to help with getting our shop up and running. I think it is fair to say that my Pop is picking this guys brain to death. . . I bet he wishes he had never met my Dad!!! He he!!
In conversation with my Pop we have spoken on many of the issues you have mentioned. We are getting there John. . . Learning from your posts and the contacts my Pop has made I think we are getting this thing surrounded!!! When we start producing them I will send you a picture of what we are manufacturing!!!
If I am ever in Dallas I will be sure to look you up. . . hopefully by that time we can compare notes!!!
Take care and thanks for all the info!!!!
Brian
Hey John,
For got to mention this. .. . we are going with the hypertherm 1250. . . my Pop has made some connections with some of the logging and trucking companies up in his neck of the woods. If they need a part that is hard to get or will take some time to ship, his is going to use our machine to fabricate the parts for them!! So hopefully this will also be a successful venture!!
Take care
Brian
Brian,
That all sounds great! Three things I’m going to recommend as you’re getting set up:
Keep us informed how it goes!
John
Thanks John. . I will. . . oh and I will probably bug you with a few more questions. . .if that is alright!!!
Take care
Brian
Very nice review- maybe a bit harsh, though! It’s expected that a promotional video for something like this is going to have a lot of hype and oversimplification. Also, I’ll have you know I still use a parrallel port for my printer!
You hit the nail on the head. The video makes it sound like anyone can use the software in no time.
Great machine, very miss leading Video.