I got a call today from Abe’s of Maine that was quite disappointing. But let me start with a little background info…
At 1:30am on Tuesday morning (4/10/2007) I ordered a new $3,379 Canon XH A1 Prosumer Camcorder from Abes for two reasons.
- First, I’ve purchased from them in the past (about 2.5 years ago) and things went OK, although the extremely high end Sony Receiver I bought from them ended up having problems and needing service I felt I couldn’t hold that against Abe’s.
- Secondly they were offering the Camcorder for about $100 less than Amazon or NewEgg.
Now, the problem started today around 6:30pm CST when I’m shopping at a retail store and I get a call on my cell phone from a “customer service” (732-225-1777) representative from Abe’s “…just wanting to verify my shipping address”. He asks me if I’ve ever purchased from them before and when I say yes, he is surprised and “can’t find me in their system”. After he “verifies my address” he begins pressuring me to purchase all sorts of add ons. And remember, this is a three and a half THOUSAND dollar purchase.
First he tells me the camcorder only comes with a 90 day warranty, so I should buy a $200 extended warranty. When I say “no thanks” he says that because I’m a “repeat customer” he can give me a 25% discount and sell it to me for only $150. At this point I inform him that Canon clearly stated that the unit comes with 1 year parts and labor and that Abe’s claims that their products include the full manufacturer’s warranty, and that my credit card doubles it.
So then he tells me “technically” that’s true, but the “boards” in the camera are only warranted for 90 days. (What?!?)
After refusing a third time, he then proceeds to try to sell me an extra battery, telling me that the camera only comes with a 30 minute “demo” battery from Canon, when I know damn well it comes with a BP-950G that reportedly lasts for 4+ hours.
After multiple refusals, he moves on down the line trying to sell me a soft case, a hard case, a tripod, a 72mm lens filter, and tapes. I might be forgetting something, but for sure he offered – actually pushed – all of those things. I kept telling him repeatedly that I didn’t need anything else.
After saying no about 30 times, he asks me “so, you’re OK with not getting the camcorder for a few weeks then?” I say, “What?” and he proceeds to tell me that if I don’t pay for upgraded shipping he intends to ship the camera via the normal United States Postal Service, and it will take at least two weeks.
We should keep in mind that they sat on this order for 2 whole days by the time I got this call, which means that had I ordered it from NewEgg it would have been arriving the next business day (tomorrow) because of their free 3 day shipping, and Amazon would have actually delivered it today.
At this point I just want off the phone with this bitter little man. I don’t trust him, I think he’s lying to me, he is not being at all respectful or slightly grateful that I’ve given them thousands of dollars, and more importantly now I feel I have no reason to trust Abe’s of Main. After all, their web page says:
Condition: All products include every manufacturer supplied accessory and USA Warranty unless stated otherwise.
Well, this guy on the phone is “stating otherwise”, and if I allow them to ship this sub-standard product to me, then open it, they’ll claim I can’t return it because it isn’t “factory fresh”.
In addition to all of that, there is a $250 rebate on this camcorder which is only valid if it comes from an authorized reseller. I have to assume that if they are going to sell the product with a 30 minute “demo” battery and only 90 days of warranty that they are not indeed authorized and that will cost me an extra $250.
So when I get home I try to call Abe’s back to cancel the order, which I know damn well hasn’t shipped yet and I get the following message when I try to reach customer service:
Audio clip: Adobe Flash Player (version 9 or above) is required to play this audio clip. Download the latest version here. You also need to have JavaScript enabled in your browser.
So, this guy calls from customer service to rake me over the coals after 7pm their time, but when I call customer service is closed at 6pm, thereby making it impossible to call back and cancel the order. I then try to use their online “Track Order” page to find out any information possible, but it literally yields nothing. All it does is pull up a copy of the receipt with no shipping status – or even area for it – anywhere visible. Nice racket they have going there.
By this point I have lost 100% of my confidence in their ability to deliver a $3,500 order as promised, so my intention is to ensure they cancel the order and do not ship it. I sent them an e-mail to cancel the order, then I called my credit card company to share the story with them and was told that the charge hasn’t even yet come through!
Wow! How is that possible? It was an e-commerce order placed online and it’s been 48 hours without the charge coming through?
Tomorrow I’ll call them as a follow up to the e-mail cancellation, and then my next move will be to order the camcorder from either NewEgg or Amazon. Most likely I’ll do Amazon and try out the free two day shipping via the Amazon Prime offer. I’ll provide updates to this story in the comments as things progress.
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Ok. So this morning I called Abe’s and after holding for a few minutes I finally reached a woman who helped cancel the order. Although today is the third day after the order, it had not yet even been charged to my credit card, and she told me it wouldn’t be.
The lady I spoke to was professional and courteous by New York standards, and I shared with her the reason I was canceling the order. She assured me that the camcorder would indeed ship exactly as packaged by Canon and apologized for the other rep’s tactics.
She told me she would inform that person’s supervisor (she knew exactly who it was) and have him listen to the recording of our call (I’d kill to get a copy of that for the blog). She further invited me not to judge the company by the actions of just one person.
I was actually prepared for a fight, so was pleasantly surprised that canceling was so easy. I give Abe’s credit on that point.
I still have concerns about their philosophical approach towards customers however, because the fact that they actually do record calls, and yet this guy was so comfortable with his lies means they are either encouraging high pressure tactics or complicit in monitoring them.
In other words, they are more concerned with grabbing a client’s money than insuring people get exactly the product that suits their needs.
I hope The Man is still cool with Amazon.com. I’ve never had a problem with them – the few returns I’ve had to make have been pretty much painless.
And then there’s this cool site I use to shop Amazon products: http://www.jangle.net
The Man can sort items by price, popularity, user ratings, discounts, and more. There’s even a neat way to view sample customer reviews.
I have bought 2 things in the past from Abes, and had EXACTLY the same experience as the poster above. The latest time was on a sony n1 camera, they hard sold me an extra battery telling me lies about its charge time and the battery that would come with the camera. When I got the camera I saw that they had told me fibs and the battery that came with the camera was much better than the one he said I would get. However, like the orig story, they rolled over very fast. I called them up, spoke to a woman, and they rolled. Gave me the battery for a much cheaper price and a free case, all because they did not want me to send the battery back. Looks like they just use bad cop (guys) good cops (girls). You just have to be careful with them, they do have good prices, but you have to stand firm and threaten to cancel the order if they pull this stuff on you. and they will try it EVERY time!
Being nickel-and-dimed on a $3,500 purchase is almost humorous. It’s almost like getting the 3rd degree when buying a new, $20,000 car to also spend $35 for the spare ashtray. Amazing. At least you didn’t knuckle under and accept your shabby treatment…I know too many people who would’ve done just that.
ouch, but how’s the camera?
Oh, I forgot to give an update…
First of all, I ordered the camcorder from Amazon.com and received it the next day! The one I got had a minor little glitch so Amazon actually shipped me a replacement and I shipped the original back.
The camcorder itsself kicks ass! I’m still practicing a little with it and then I’m going to post some videos and a review. Suffice it to say that it is far, far, far better than anything you can purchase at Best Buy.
John
if you can please let me know WHO your salesmen was, i will have corrective action taken. i belive these complaints are all from the same salesman, but i never get a name with the complaints, only complaints that ruin our image..
thank you
SM
SM,
I appreciate your interest in tracking down the culprit, but when I called and spoke with the customer service rep to cancel the order she told me she was aware of who it was and was going to inform his supervisor. So, if that didn’t happen it would be disappointing. If you do a search in your system for my name I’m sure I’ll be the only one in there so you can look up the order in question and get whatever details you keep on file.
On another note, having run call centers in the past I would recommend that you could solve this issue by either ensuring that your system tracks customer touch points in a notes field along with each order, or by doing random call monitoring.
In a case where you suspect a particular individual you can obviously monitor their calls and take care of that issue in about one day.
John
Understood. we do have that technology in place, but i am more concerned in the customer (in this case, you) chaging the bitter taste that a bad salesman has unfortunately imparted on you. Thank you for your time. I hope your future online sales experiences are better.
SM
No offense, but I doubt you really care about the customer, you’re just concerned of the bad image this post is giving you when someone googles “abes of main”(without the ‘e’, it ranks 5 or 6, and with experience, i can tell that most people search it that way)…
Instead of giving an honest apology, you are preaching that you will take actions, actions that should have already been taken long time ago because you already have all the information needed…
In short, when you really care about the customer, you should say that appropriate actions have been taken and please accept “enter your offer here(less than 3 digits is an insult)” gift certificate on our behalf as a thank you for helping us find the bad apple which is ruining it for the rest of us.
This is how, in my opinion, you change the bitter taste that a bad salesman carves on the customer. Don’t you agree?
Johny – Actually I think you basically said what I had been thinking without saying it. But since you’ve opened the door:
Regarding finding the Sales person:
And a few other things:
Finally, I took the statement “…complaints that ruin our image…” as a jab. It is not my complaint that ruined your image, but the treatment I recieved at the hands of your employee that ruined it. All I did was document my experience.
I’m sure the management team at Abe’s has heard the saying that if a customer has a bad experience they’ll tell 7 people… Well, in my case I just share the really bad ones with my 250,000+ monthly visitors. On the flip side, when I do my product review I’d have been happy to recommend Abe’s – had everything gone smoothly.
John
Thanks for the story John. I’d wish I would have read this before purchasing from Abes Of Maine.
I recently purchased a Canon XL2 and experienced the same thing. First order, they canceled without me even knowing. All because they didn’t catch me at home by phone. So I call like a week later and they said to place the order again. So I do. Then I get an email 2 days latter to call them for confirmation. Like you, I wasn’t too happy with that 2 days of shipping delay. The sales person was trying to sell me all the accessories too. He finally pushed the Mack 4 year extended warranty onto me and said if I wasn’t happy I could return it within 30 days. Now, Im trying to get an RMA# to return it…the person at the RMA department transfers me to their sales rep. and here the sales rep. trying to lower the price ect. When I firmly say I cannot afford it…the phone mysteriously hangs up. When I call back, they say I will have to wait till another sales person come in and gives me his extension #. I notice, it is the rep. that first processed my order. So from this…I can conclude, it is a tactic of theirs with all employees involved. Why even have an RMA department when ultimately they are just middlemen that will transfer you to a pushy salesman?
This experience has felt like a big weight on my shoulders and I would hope to never experience anything like it again. Do not shop at Abes Of Maine!
Akira,
I’m very sorry to hear that you had this experience. :-( I would definitely suggest that you dispute the initial charge with your credit card and tell them exactly the info you shared here.
If the company has a guarantee that you can cancel within 30 days then you need external documentation that you’ve been trying to do so and even if the credit card dispute is denied just having it on record would provide the evidence you need.
If you have a good credit card company then they should at least help you put pressure on Abe’s.
Good luck,
John
Shortly after posting…I called Abe’s back and wouldn’t you know, they obviously keep track of this blog and promised to make things right. corrections…it was Customer Service. He issued me an RMA # and said I could include the shipping receipt and they will reimburst me for that as well. Plus they will send me 5 free mini dv tapes. I declined the offer but he insisted so I’ll be greatfull. Well thanks to Customer Service for understanding and thanks John for your blog spot!!!
I was planning to buy from Abe, but not any more. I will get my stuff from BH.
Guys and girls, they have been doing business this way since they opened. I had the same sort of experience with them in ’82 or ’83 trying to buy a motor drive for one of my Nikons. It’s really a wonder they’re still around.
I have not dealt with AbesofMaine but I hear the same story again and again with a number of bait and switch NY companies. I only deal with B&H and in the last 10 years I can say “I do not have one complaint. Always on time, always truthful and fair prices. “
I can also confirm those bad, bad, bad selling tactics of Abe’s of Maine people. And, it is not one person that´s bad, it is the company. I was called several times about a warranty that is not necessary, I insisted on not wanting it (makes no sense, you can also burn your money), but others from the company kept calling and bugging me about it. One guy said “no, not the same deal than yesterday. I am actually the manager, I can give you another discount on the warranty!”.
No thanks. I hated to, but I had to become rude in order to finally let them understand that I don´t need a warranty that´s not required. What drove me upset is, that they repeatedly lied to me about the original warranty. One should sue them for that.
Anyway, they finally understood and I got my appliance fast and well packed. Won´t buy from them anymore – rather pay 5bucks more somewhere else and know I am with someone who doesn´t lie. In case of real problem – you cannot believe anything they tell you.
“NO THANKS – ABE OF MAINE”
I just ordered a Canon 5D and wish I would have found this blog before I did. Man I hope I didn’t make a mistake 3k is alot of money… Sweating it now!
I’ve ordered from Abes several times and have had mostly positive experiences (thus the reason I am a repeat customer). They often have great prices, and compensate for the lower margins by encouraging and rewarding this kind of cross-selling. I don’t mind the cross-sales pitch too much because I don’t feel that it is “High Pressure” selling like I’ve experienced from other less-reputable shops. One time i cancelled an order at two other places before a final, third attempt with Abes, which turned out fine. So maybe the perception is all relative to the other guys being worse. With Abes, you tell the guy “no thanks” and then you are done, the item is shipped. That is fine by me if the price is good and the salesperson is not “too” pushy.
Darren,
I’m glad you haven’t had a problem with Abes. However, just a few follow up points:
Just my opinion. But hey, since this is the blog getting the attention I guess that matters. :-)
John
Maybe Thanks…
As to my post above. I received my 5D in a timely fashion and was pleased. I did however get a call to “confirm” the order which was done without incident and that’s all I could have asked for :)
I ordered a Panasonic DX1 at the good price of $479 delivered, yesterday. Today I got an email to call Sol to confirm. Having had trouble with scammers before, I called expecting the worst. But Sol merely confirmed the order, offered me a lense filter or a carrying bag, and when I politely said “no”, he wished me best-of-luck with the camera.
I seem to remember ordering from them a few years ago and having no problems. I suppose they do make money selling extras, and I can see a bad kind of salesman on commission doing the bad things described, but overall they may be OK. Sol was, anyway.
I’ll say more if there’s trouble with the camera when it arrives, but so far so good.
Well, this blog just saved me the trouble! I’ve heard of these types of sleeze operations before. they offer a price lower than the others, then pressure people to buy extra junk at outrageous prices. They slow down the order, or do whatever they can to keep the pressure up. Just goes back to that old saying “If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.” It’s not just one bad salesman folks, it’s the company!
I ordered a 50″ Pioneer Plasma last wednesday and got the confirmation call on Thursday. The salesman was not to pushy and i didnt buy anything except for the white glove delivery. They say it shipped today so let’s see what happens. Hopefully i have it by Wednesday but am waiting for tracking or a call from the shipping company.
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